For this post, respond to the ideas that a fellow student has shared during the in-class formal discussion of Acts I and II of The Crucible
(Wednesday and Thursday). If you agree, extend the other student's
ideas by explaining why they are so essential and meaningful. If you
disagree, politely explain why you disagree and offer an alternative
understanding or interpretation.
This post will be due on Friday, not Thursday. Thanks, Mr. Telles.
For me, someone who brought up a really good point about the play was Olivia (Morris). Olivia brought up the idea that no one is willing to say that they do not believe in this whole witchcraft business. She said that Parris might the one to do it, but at this point so many people are skeptical that it could be anyone. The drama in this play is really the characters trying to get the spotlight of witchcraft and devilry (yes, "devilry" is a word; I looked it up) off of themselves and the only way to do this is to blame others for what has happened. So, as Olivia expressed, this creates lots of tension within the characters. They absolutely could be wanting to say that none of this is true, or that it is all made up. But, in situations of mass hysteria such as this, any form of denial could actually do the opposite of what that person was trying to do. Denying "crime," such as witchcraft, in this time, only made you that more suspicious. The only was to save yourself from indictment is to make sure you are never brought up when it comes to black magic and things of the sort. All one could do is blame others and hope no one blames you. Because, if you are the one who is "bringing others to justice," you would be seen as a hero, as Rev. Hale is seen. But, if you are in the midst of this mess, and someone mentions that you could have some connection to these "crimes," you are automatically a suspect. And the suspects did not really get to defend themselves all that much. Sure, they could say whatever they want to try and get themselves off the hook, but when people are convinced of something supernatural like this witchcraft ordeal, they are not so easily swayed. People have a primal urge to protect themselves and their loved ones. Such as, blaming others of things which were actually nobody's fault to begin with, and even going along with some crazy theology even though they do not believe in it. So, again, I completely agree with Olivia; no one is going to admit that they think that the witchcraft is all a hoax, because they believe that if they do, they will become the next target, and then they will never be able to escape from this complete abomination of a situation.
ReplyDeleteI mostly agree with what everyone said. However, one of the things Josh said I didn’t really understand completely or agree with. He had said that the reason Abigail acted the way she did was because she was still a teenager with mood swings and hormones. But the play actually states at one point that Abigail is 17 or 18, and ready to be married. So in my opinion, I don’t think she would still be in the puberty phase. I did agree with what Josh said about the “outbreak” of “witchcraft” to be a trend. Since most of the leaders, like the reverends, believe in the presence of witchcraft in Salem therefore everyone else follows along. If they don’t they are either accused of being a witch themselves of are killed, or both. I also agree with Olivia and Sarah. The women who are calling out other women could be doing it out of revenge or spite. Abigail, for example, calls out Elizabeth because she had had an affair with Elizabeth’s husband, John Proctor, and wants John to herself. So, by saying that Elizabeth is with the devil, she is taken away and John is left alone. Referring to what Sarah had said, Mr. Walcott accused Martha of being a witch because the pic she sold him died a week after he bought it. Mr. Walcott, not wanting to blame himself for the death of the pig, blames Martha instead and says she is in cohorts with the devil. Lastly, I also agree with what Jenna said. Jenna had said that Tituba called out the homeless people because she didn’t want to be killed, they didn’t have much going for them, and now the spotlight was off of her. So Tituba basically just wanted to save herself from being killed; it wasn’t because she was mad at those people or she wanted revenge.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Josh and possess similar ideas towards this issue of witchcraft. I believe that all of the incidents that are occurring are simply a cause of mind over matter. There are no real witches residing in the town of Salem. All of the characters have just created a false reality and convinced themselves of an issue that does not even exist. The characters are all psychosomatic and are fighting with an internal conflict rather than any witches. Furthermore, Josh stated that the characters will not deny the existence of witches since it will result in them being accused. Those individuals who do name witches, understand that there is no such thing, but continue to do it in order to portray themselves as heroic and reputable. I would like to add that all these accusations are merely grudges that the characters have held. For example, Walcott, after purchasing a pig from Gile’s wife, was unable to properly feed the animal. It soon died, and Walcott revisited Gile’s wife demanding that she return his money. Gile’s wife denied Walcott his refund and this slight issue later turned into a death sentence for Gile’s wife. All of the adults are well aware of the reality, yet they repress that thought, persuading themselves that they are truly encountering supernatural forces. What I also noticed was that Salem has many reputable, high-status individuals, such as Rebecca Nurse, Francis Nurse, and even the Proctors, who all are respected in the town. There are also some individuals, such as Abigail, who are given bad reputations for their past. In order to erase her past and climb up the social hierarchy, Abigail, along with others, resorts to paranormal forces, such as witchcraft. By eliminating the well-respected characters, Abigail can gain a higher reputation, all the while being considered as the innocent young girl who cleansed the town of its evil, devilish forces. Simply put, witchcraft does not exist and the characters are only using it as an excuse for their own selfish motives.
ReplyDeleteDuring class I felt like we had an excellent discussion. Many people brought up some very good points and I can honestly say I agree with everything everyone said. I very strongly agree with one of the points Josh made about the whole mind over matter theory. I couldn’t have said it better myself! Josh also said society changes but people don’t, which is very true. People still try to convince themselves of things that simply aren’t true but since they keep telling themselves it is the truth they begin to believe it themselves. I believe every character in this story has a reason to believe in witchcraft in order to not have to deal with their own reality and personal issues. As Josh said, you create your own reality when you are convinced of something. As Mr. Telles summarized it, the line between “reality” and belief becomes blurred. So basically Josh is really insightful and awesome, I totally agree with everything he said!
ReplyDeleteIn our class discussion, people made some pretty good points. I agree with Olivia when she said that everyone is motivated to believe in witchcraft because it was a “trend” to blame your enemies for revenge of being a witch. Also, because if you choose to be different and believe witchcraft isn’t a thing, you now will be accused of a witch. Or if you didn’t believe in witchcraft, your fellow neighbors will drill it in your head that your wife, daughter or maybe even yourself is a witch because people tend to know more things about yourself than you do and they are always “right”. During this time if you were to say so and so sold me crops and they rotted, the town would now accuse you of being a witch and take you to court. I also agreed with Jenna when she said Tituba was only blaming homeless people for associating with the devil because they had nothing going for them. I thought this was very thoughtful of Tituba for not blaming a mother or a daughter. When people started using witchcraft for revenge is when everything got out of control. I believe if this were to happen to all the guys instead of the girls, this situation would have been more honest because girls can get out of hand. For example, when Abigail accused Elizabeth of practicing witchcraft. I thought this was the most selfish because she did this strictly because she has a crush on Elizabeth’s husband. Abigail actually went to the extent to send this poor innocent wife to jail just for a guy who doesn’t even like her.
ReplyDeleteI feel like we had excellent discussions the past two days, everyone had a lot of great thoughts and ideas on certain characters and scenes.Aside from my own thoughts, I pretty much agreed with everyone else. However there was one thought of Josh’s that I didn’t really understand nor agree with and that was when he said that Abigail’s age was causing her to behave the way she has in the past two acts, that her “hormones” and “mood swings” were causing this mess I disagree, Abigail’s age was between 17-18 years so she would pretty much be out of the awkward puberty phase and in those times, she’d be ready to wed. I feel like something along the lines of envy would make more sense for her actions. There was one thought of Josh’s and also a bit of Olivia’s (Morris’) that I had completely agreed though, and that was about how Hale was kind of wishy-washy and how he didn’t say anything to the court about what happened at the Proctors or that he’s a bit convinced that all this insanity is fake and there is no witchcraft, because he’s afraid that both the people and the court will turn on him or accuse him of witchcraft or he’s just afraid that if he speaks his mind he’ll lose power and ruin reputation.
ReplyDeleteDuring our discussion in class about The Crucible many good points were brought up and addressed. Jenna said one thing that I really agreed with. Jenna said that when Tituba was first accused, and was forced into accusing others, she chose people that were lower on the social ladder than her and had nothing going for them. If they were hanged, none of them would have a grieving family to be upset. Though when Betty and Abigail started to accuse people, they moved up the social ladder to people they did not like or had grudges against. These people all had families that would miss them if they were convicted of witchcraft and murdered. Tituba had to chose lower class people because she was a servant and no one would believe her if she started accusing high class people in the town. It was also merciful for Tituba to chose these poor people who don’t even have a home, rather than people who would have husbands and children missing them. Though I do want to add a point to what Jenna had said. Tituba was not just naming names of lower class citizens just because of the reasons I have already named. If you reread the part in the play where Tituba is being interrogated by Reverend Hale and the others to tell them who was also in league with the Devil, you notice that Tituba names every name the others, like Mrs. Putnam, already accused. You can take this a couple different ways. It could be that Tituba was so nervous and scared for her life that she could not think of any other names on the top of her head. Or maybe Tituba was just trying to please everyone so she could save herself. Tituba could have thought that pleasing all of them would let the people stop accusing more innocents of witchcraft. Though another reason could have been that Tituba figured that if she said names of previous suspicion, then they would more likely believe her than names of people no one had considered yet.
ReplyDeleteIn class Gwon said that the climax of the play so far is when all of the towns folk gather at John Proctor’s home and take Elizabeth Proctor away in chains. Gwon also went on to say that Mary Warren is struggling with the dilemma of who to side with, Elizabeth or Abigail. I agree with Gwon in both points because many conflicts are brought up in that short period of time between when Hale comes to the Proctor’s door and Elizabeth is taken away. Also I feel as though Act three and the outcome of the play will be determined by Mary Warren’s decision. Mary has two paths she can take in deciding the fate of Elizabeth and many factors influencing both paths. She can choose to side with Abigail and try to get Elizabeth hanged. She would choose this side because she and Abigail are close friends and, as Whitney put it, Mary Warren could feel some power over her former masters. On the other side of the coin, however, the Proctor’s have put a roof over her head and supplied her with food for some time so she must feel some obligation to be loyal to them. I feel like Mary Warren will side with Abigail because as Josh put it many people are using the idea of witchcraft in Salem for personal gain and revenge. I agree with this and we have already seen it happen. For instance Abigail is using the idea of witchcraft to attempt to win back John Proctor. Mary Warren could do a similar thing by using her power over Elizabeth’s fate as leverage to try to make her living conditions under the Proctor’s roof more leisurely. Either way Mary Warren will be the center piece of Act three and will determine the outcome of the play.
ReplyDeleteDuring the formal discussion of The Crucible, Josh said some things and I strongly agree with. Josh said that the witchcraft epidemic was a matter of mind over matter. The whole theory that many women in this town could possibly witches was all in their heads. Many townspeople must believe that there is no such thing as witches but other people such as Mrs. Putnam have their minds set on believing in the supernatural. I think Mrs. Putnam is just looking for any plausible reason to explain the infant deaths of her seven children that she is going to extreme lengths to find answers. When Tituba was accused of witchcraft, she had to accuse other women to prevent herself from being hanged and ultimately chose women from a lower social status than her and they were women who did not have families that would grieve their deaths if they were to be hanged. Whitney said that when Abigail, Mercy, and Betty began accusing others also, they named certain people to get back at them. I agree with this because many of the people they accused had wronged them in one way or another previously until they started naming women at random. Josh also said that by accusing others of witchcraft, those women were deemed heroic and that by naming Goody Osborne as a witch, it was the perfect accusation. Since Tituba named Goody Osborne she was off the hook from being hanged and it could satisfy Mrs. Putnam’s need to know what may have caused her children to die. If Goody Osborne was found guilty of witchcraft, it would be all the evidence Mrs. Putnam needed to conclude that her children were cursed since it was Goody Osborne who helped care for them after their birth.
ReplyDeleteIn our discussion, Katelyn Moore presented two ideas that I both agreed and disagreed with. She stated her opinion that Abigail is emotionally unstable. She also came to the conclusion that her emotional instability could have caused her wild accusations of witchcraft. I believe that those statements made are only partly true. Abigail does have the experiences that can lead to her insanity. One of those experiences was the murder of her parents. The other event that could have made Abigail emotionally unstable is the whispers that follow her like a shadow about her affair; whispers which were inflicted upon her by Proctor’s wife. Although this does explain why she may have become accusatory, the fact is that Abigail may have turned this way for many reasons. Firstly, much like Josh Flynn said, she could be using the hysteria as a way to acquire the attention she desires. Another possibility, similar to what Sarah Burnham stated, is Abigail may have had a motive to seek revenge on Elizabeth Proctor. Although there is no definite answer to what made Abigail confess to a false catastrophe, the readers are able to infer that her past trauma may have played a lethal part to her twisted game. To conclude, I agree with most of the points said by Katelyn Moore, but I disagree with the second statement claiming Abigail’s previous trauma has led to the lunacy of the witch trials.
ReplyDeleteThere were so many amazing ideas and conversations brought up during the discussion. I really loved hearing theories and ideas that we hadn't previously talked about as a class. One idea that I really agreed with was made by Josh. Josh proposed the mind over matter idea. I think this is an extremely vital part of how the Puritan ideas, no matter how crazy they were, continued on for many years. The power ridden leaders of Salem convinced themselves and others that there was an evil force causing any misfortune that struck them. The crucible shows a time where the people of Salem were so caught up in the insanity taking place, that they had no choice but to go along with it. These people convinced themselves of something so unimaginable. They convinced themselves that people were walking with the devil and spitting evil onto others. I'm sure some people believed in witchcraft for fear of being rejected, but it does also seem that some people have convinced themselves that witchcraft is real - no matter the reality of the peculiar thought. Take Mrs.Putnam for example. We see her loss as severe misfortune, because there is no other explanation to something so devastating. From Mrs.Putnam's perspective, a grief stricken mother, it must be easy to convince your self that there is a supernatural cause for these losses. For many people it must have come naturally to repress the confusion of witchcraft, for facing the confusion would lead to contention with the leaders of Salem. I believe the majority of people in Salem convinced themselves of witchcraft so that they could somehow explain the unfair and ridiculous times. In a time when freedom of speech was a solemn spoken idea, the residents of Salem were better off believing what the majority of the people were believing. This tactic of becoming someone whose mind withheld the common idea of the majority in a chaotic world was a clever one, for the people who believed very rarely found themselves as a target.
ReplyDeleteOur discussion on The Crucible over the past two days in class has led to a lot of people to make really interesting theories about why Abigail Williams is being so generally terrible in the book by accusing so many innocent people and coercing her friends to do the same. Josh and Katelyn made some pretty excellent points on this. Josh said the main reason that Abigail was doing this was for the attention. I personally think that this is one of those things that should be universally agreed on. This is shown when Tituba is accusing people and has the spotlight for a few seconds in the scene, and Abigail, realizing this, starts to accuse people as well, so that the attention reverts back to her. Another point in the book that shows her need for attention is when she is harassing John Proctor, and her wanting to get rid of his wife Elizabeth so that she may have him to herself. Another theory that Josh had about Abigail was that part of why she was doing this besides the need for attention was that she is a teenager, so she has all of her crazy teenage hormones rushing through her body, and its making her want attention oh so much more badly, and doing awful things to get it. His point was basically, teenagers back then acted the same as teenagers do now, only they deal with their emotions in different ways. I do not all too particularly agree with his thought that these teenage emotions are why Abigail is doing what she is doing, just because she is indeed on the older side of being a teen, and she went through puberty years ago if she is around 18, so most of the crazy hormones should be gone by now. So by this sentiment, I agree with Katelyn on that it was not puberty driving Abigail to do such awful things, but that it was probably her terrible childhood. If her parents died when she was on the younger side, that would mean she has been mostly raised by her uncle Parris, who, judging by their interaction in act one, does not seem to care for her a whole lot. She’s practically starved for attention. Whatever it was, Abigail’s drive for attention and the terrible things she’s doing and the people she’s convincing is pretty awful, and I think can best be summed up by Owen’s statement, “Maybe she’s the devil.”
ReplyDeleteDuring our discussion today, we talked about how a lot of people only accused others of witchcraft in a desperate attempt to find a scapegoat. I absolutely agree with this. Most people did not actually believe in witchcraft, but their instinct of self-preservation drove them to join the hysteria. At first, people were just using witchcraft to explain things that they could not explain themselves, or to make it seem like a situation that they caused was actually completely out of their control. For example, Mrs. Putnam used witchcraft to explain the death of seven of her newborn babies. However, as the idea of witchcraft spread throughout the town the situation developed into something much more extreme. After Tituba “confessed” to practicing witchcraft, more and more people began to blindly accuse others of the same thing. Although the majority of the people did not actually believe in witches, when they saw the consequences that accused witches began to face they felt that they had to begin accusing others too in order to save themselves and solidify their innocence. They believed that if they accused other people of witchcraft, then they’d be seen as a victim and would not have to worry about being accused themselves. I think that everyone’s fear of being the next person accused was definitely a huge factor in why the residents of Salem seemed to accept the idea of witchcraft so quickly.
ReplyDeleteDuring our discussions over the past few days, we have mentioned Abigail and her role in the story many times. I agree with what Whitney said in that Abigail planted the seed of hysteria simply to get out of trouble only to watch it sprout into mayhem. As it grew she began to realize that she had a great amount of power over this expanding tree of accusation. Once this realization was made she began to use it in terms of her own motives, such as getting to have John proctor for herself. In order to accomplish this goal she began pointing fingers at his wife and then framed her for a stabbing to seal the deal. Another thing we talked about is that if anyone knew that witchcraft is not real, then it would be very difficult for them to say this in fear of being accused. This became clear toward the end of Act II when John Proctor attributes these accusations to vengeance. As we also said, it would be incredibly difficult for Hale to admit that there is no witchcraft because everyone sees him as a man of god. I think it would actually be a different case for him as long as he came to the realization before anyone was hanged. This is because if they know he is a minister then they also must know that the devil cannot get to him. Also, he seems to have quite a bit of control over the situation and if he stood against the belief of anything supernatural then many would follow him. Not to mention that he stated in the beginning that they must be prepared if he determines that there is no mark of hell found in their situation, even if he did lead the witch hunt. Overall though, I had no other disagreements with the ideas that were brought up in class.
ReplyDeleteDuring our class discussion we had over the past two days Josh brought up some really interesting points. He said that people tend to “create a reality when they’re convinced of something”. I agree with this statement because most of the people in The Crucible probably don’t believe in witches, but since everyone else is acting like they’re real others begin to think that too. Josh had also said it was sort of a “mind over matter” situation. Just like how when you get hurt, your mom always tells you to not think about it and it will feel better, well it’s the same in this case. The more the people think witches are real, the more it seems to become real. In the beginning of the book no one was really convinced about witchcraft. They just thought weird things were happening that they couldn’t explain. After a while though they needed an explanation for these weird occurrences so they started to believe maybe it actually could be witches or association with the devil. Then, after this news got out other people started to think of weird things that had happened to them and they started to believe in witchcraft also.
ReplyDeleteDuring our class discussion, I thought everyone made some very good points. Josh made some really good points on how its "mind over matter". People aren't really thinking how other people may feel, they just want all the negative energy away from them. He also said that witchcraft is a used for attention or recognition. I thought this was a very good point. "People are accusing others and becoming a hero". I also thought Olivia made some every good contributions to the class. She said that people sometimes create fake scenarios or they use witchcraft as payback and how no one is stepping up to say that this witchcraft rumor isn't true. Sarah is the person I agree with the most. She says that people may believe in witchcraft even though its not true. They might believe in it because everyone else does. She also mentioned how people might accuse others because they are jealous. I think that in the near future, someone will step up and say this isn't true what were we thinking accusing people of something that may not exist.
ReplyDeleteWe had a class discussion about the Crucibles. I think Josh made some very good points on how the a lot of people in the play are putting their "Mind over Matter". Now, by seeing all of the other posts, I realize that most other people are saying that as well, but I truly think that because Josh was such an active member of the discussion, he was able to realize more about his statements than he planned on saying when he raised his hand. Now, truth be told, this play has really confused me quite a bit, but hearing everyone else's ideas, I definitely understand it much better. People in the story are telling themselves over and over again that others are doing witchcraft, and the more they say it, the more they believe it. Basically, they are tricking themselves into this and digging deeper holes. I agree that people are accusing others just to get the title of a hero. This is because when the final conclusion is made about witchcraft- who is doing it and who isn't- they will be able prove that they were right, and thought that all along. The characters change their guesses based on the newest information they have received, trying to mold their theories into something new that they heard through the grapevine.
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